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1. Steven Zack
   Member
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   From what i found out, that is every time someone, can't win, or going on tilt, they aways say the site is rigged...
   But i have some points for the ones who say poker is rigged...
   You can't win. Well that has to, do with not getting any poker books, or thinking the way you see poker played on TV is how you are, to play, you are so wrong.
   Going on tilt. You are seeing 2 to 3 times more hands, online then you would in a real poker game.
   Bad beats. They are part of poker, will happen in real poker, as anyone can watch the WSOP on TV, you can see some bad beats.

   If you can not take the FAQs that i posted, then you should stop playing right now, i am sick of hearing how everyone, that is a losing player, say on line poker is rigged, to anyone who thinks i am full of BS, go to a real poker table, and see if you win...
   RANT done

   Posted 1 year ago #

2. Eric Blade
   Moderator
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   Although most all of us agree with this, there's not much of anything at all that this has to do with the Poker Players Alliance, Players Rights, legalities, etc.

   Posted 1 year ago #

3. Rich Muny
   State Director & Forum Admin
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   Now that the repetitive posts from the "online poker is rigged" conspiracy theorist(s) (I think it's just one person) has died down, I think we can unlock this. However, this thread is still NOT the place for posting of such conspiracy theories.

   If you have questions about this, please check the FAQ.

   Posted 1 year ago #

4. Rich Muny
   State Director & Forum Admin
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   From the FAQ:

   What are the PPA Forums not?

   The PPA Forums are NOT places to post conspiracy theories about "rigged sites." Such posts will be deleted, and those making such posts will be banned. Posters with usernames like "xx_site_is_rigged" will be banned as well.

   Sorry, but poker has a high variance. Less skilled players often stay in to the end, hoping for a miracle card. Deal with it.

   It's your responsibility as a player to adjust to other players, not for them to adjust to you. If you regularly bluff calling stations, expect to lose money. If you're surprised that calling stations stay in to the bitter end, expect to lose money.

   Nor are PPA Forums a place to post personal attacks against people who disagree with you. We're all on the same side.

   Posted 1 year ago #

5. BUTCH LUTZ
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   In response to TheEngineer - I totally disagree - While I'm not hard core either way on whether SOME sites are what-ever you want to call it (rigged, partially rigged, unfair, or not-realistic), I hold my oppion that the possibilites are there. AND, should someone who is a member of this association NOT be allowed to post in proper taste thier belifs or opinion and thier reasons for thinking so, then I don't know if I need to be a member any longer, and should submit a letter pulling my name from the petitions that I have signed. It is called FREEDOM of Speech.

   Posted 1 year ago #

6. thunderacura
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   I think The Engineer's main concern on this subject is that there exists some posts by members claiming a site is rigged when they have no factual basis for their claims. They are just venting from a bad beat. If the claims can be proven by facts, then I believe they should be allowed here. I personally believe that while cheaters (be it bots, collusion techniques, or other devices) may or may not exist on sites. The site itself gains nothing by cheating the player. The well publicized case of the AP/UB scandal should not make you think that these poker sites are out to rip you off. Apparently this was a case of a corrupt current or ex-employee with a high level of security access. There are things that I can do at the company I work for that could cause me great gains in the short term, as we store very sensitive information on clients. It's likely that no one would every catch it, but I have integrity.

   Posted 1 year ago #

7. Rich Muny
   State Director & Forum Admin
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   KARAOKEBUTCH,

   I tried to administer this forum with very minimal interference. Unfortunately, we had a small group who overran the forum with "xxx is rigged" conspiracy posts. They had no data or evidence to back their posts. They also weren't asking for anything from PPA (i.e., they didn't post "xxx is rigged, so PPA ought to do y"). So, this was not a free speech question -- these posts were nothing more than unfounded accusations on the integrity of sites and rude trolling attacks on our regular posters. It was time to take control of the forum.

   However, now that things have calmed down, I just did like every other poker forum and started an official thread for all such discussion: Official bad beat/'online poker is rigged' thread. If someone wishes to make an "online poker is rigged" conspiracy post and has no data or evidence to back it up, this is the ONLY thread on the PPA Forums where such posts are acceptable. Posts on the subject made elsewhere will be deleted (I'd prefer to simply move them, but the forum software does not have that capability.)

   That being said, if someone feels a site is rigged and posts statistical data or real proof to back it up, such posts are (as they always have been) permitted on the general forum.

   Posted 1 year ago #

8. Rich Muny
   State Director & Forum Admin
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   Originally posted by KARAOKEBUTCH
   ... should someone who is a member of this association NOT be allowed to post in proper taste thier belifs or opinion and thier reasons for thinking so, then I don't know if I need to be a member any longer, and should submit a letter pulling my name from the petitions that I have signed. It is called FREEDOM of Speech.

   Members are permitted to post their opinions on poker sites here and always have been. The issue here is that some trolls who experienced bad beats came here specifically to overrun and disrupt the forum. They made it clear that their goal is to have all online poker banned. Informing them that legislation promoted by the PPA would provide for RNG audits and other verifications of site integrity did nothing, as they were not here for discussion. They were here for disruption.

   Posted 1 year ago #

9. Eric Blade
   Moderator
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   As mod, I will follow the rules I am given, as closely as I can, and follow TE and other admin's leads.

   As a PPA member, however, frankly, I feel that discussion of any particular site, it's merits or lackthereof, has no particular place on the PPA forums. There are plenty of other forums dedicated to general online poker things like that. With a million members, this forum should be absolutely bustling with activity regarding things the PPA actually are and should be involved with. I just cannot even begin to imagine why someone would come to a forum that is clearly by and for a group dealing with legislation and criminal issues, and start going on about the same back-and-forth they do on the 2p2 or p5 forums.

   Karaokebutch, so by what you're saying, is we should allow a discussion here on the merits of Obama's birth certificate, as long as it's by a PPA member? Or the merits of Apple Pie vs Strawberry Pie? By TheEngineer's edict, you are certainly free to discuss how you feel about site X. I just can't figure out why you would.

   *as always, just because I have a "moderator" tag under my name, doesn't mean I am speaking on behalf of the PPA - I am just a member like everyone else here, and everything I say is my own opinion

   Posted 1 year ago #

10. HoldemEagle
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    I had to chime in with my opinion on this one. Free speech doesn't give
    you the right to yell fire when there is no evidence of a fire or call
    someone a thief when you have no evidence that they are a thief.

    The cards have been running really bad for me for a couple of months. So
    I watched some good players in the games I was playing (SnG 180's) to see
    if I was doing anything that might be adding to this bad run. I also
    checked to see if the good players ever run bad like me. I checked their
    ROI per 100 games because I check my ROI per 100 games. What I found was
    they ran as bad and sometimes worse than I do. They also ran very good in
    some of the 100 games. Running bad for 1 or 2 hundred games was common
    and they would flat line sometimes for up to 1200 games or more. But in
    the end the good runs made up for the bad and they had +ROI. The good
    players I checked played 30 to 100 games a day. Running bad for a couple
    of 100 games to them would be over in a few days and even the 1200 games
    would be over in a few weeks. The casual player might only play say 5
    games a day. 200 games of running bad to him would take 6 weeks to get
    through. The swings will be worse for the casual players because most
    casual players are not as good as the Pro's. This running bad/good is
    normal and that is the reason bankroll management is a skill that needs
    to be learned.

    IMO the bigger sites are legit because it can only hurt them not to be.
    Also IMO licensing and regulation would protect the players more from smaller
    and start up sites who would be force to give evidence of who the owner
    is before they could get a license. IMO licensing and regulation would
    also give you a place to get help if any site has wronged you.

    I like the following articles and thought I would include the links.

    Mentality of a closer

    Bankroll Management

    glgl

    Posted 1 year ago #

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