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11. Shane Stacey
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    Don't be deluded into thinking that the regulatory agencies govering gambling in a number of states weren't set-up to protect their states' tax revenues. Also, the online poker community is one of the best self-policed entities out there, given communities like 2+2, where the UB/AP scandal was brought to light. When you look at the data collectively held by said membership, ANY incongruency can be ferreted-out. For you to claim that these rooms answer to no one is absurd. Look at the traffic on UB/AP compared to that of PS and FTP. UB used to run a strong 3rd in the US market once Party left, and now struggles for the same marketshare as Cake and Carbon.

    Also, the UB/AP scandal was perpetrated by former management within the company. They used it for personal gain and it wasn't the operating site which benefited.

    I've been playing poker as a primary income source, not affiliated with any online site, for the past 3+ years. I have literally seen millions of hands between my live and online play, and understand that variance is the beast that can never be slain. I have seen set over set over set at least a dozen times, both online and live. I have seen flopped overfulls beaten when running underpairs hit quads - I saw this twice within a 6-hour period at the WSOP. I've started telling the online community that "live poker is rigged". After I make a statement like this at the table, people laugh. They laugh almost as hard as I do when they address how rigged online poker is.

    When I see people complaining online at the table about how "the site is rigged" or how "online poker is rigged", I've gotten in the habit of doing a quick stat check. At least 95 times in 100, the person complaining is a losing player. How much have you lost online, Nick? :)

    I may go look at the hand-analysis for kicks, given I do have a background (and degree) in mathematics ... this will be right after I construct a spare tinfoil hat.

    Posted 9 months ago #

12. Eric Blade
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    nmaiorana: no, i see far more bad beats offline than I do online, because the players are absolutely terrible.

    How, exactly, does a poker room profit from the outcome of hands?

    What you're saying regarding AJ Green, is that because AJ Green was cheating, that the entire company knew about it?

    Who could be cheating at SecureCardDealer.com ? You can't propose a system where the automatic system can tell what cards belong where, without someone who could potentially compromise that system being able to also do the same.

    Part of why we trust the poker sites to provide a fair system, is because the poker sites themselves have nothing to gain. We can only implicitly trust everyone else that there are no other backdoors like the AP and UB backdoors, because as has been shown, for a large site to experience a breach like that, it would cause a significant loss of players, and for a small site, it would be a complete disaster. Now, if you're trusting an online slot machine, that's a different matter entirely. (and no, the only machine I trust at a live casino is the ATM, and it will screw me out of money too :D )

    Posted 9 months ago #

13. Eric Blade
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    BTW, before someone points out that a site makes more money when bigger hands are going via the rake, let me point out that the maximum rake online pretty much ranges between $3 and $4, and at any stakes higher than around $0.50c/$1.00NL or 25c/50c FL you're probably going to be at max rake for the table for any hand actually played. So, if sites were going to attempt to maximize their rake that way, they'd run chop-hands against each other a lot more often than normal - the players get to keep most of their money, and only give up the rake.

    I don't know what it'd be like now, but some time ago, I calculated that the take on Cake Poker (back when it was much smaller) was probably close to around $200,000 per month, just on cash games. Of course, I don't know what their expenses are, but I bet it's significantly less than $200k/month.

    Posted 9 months ago #

14. Nick Maiorana
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    Bottom line is that you can't put a camera on electronic data. Anything is possible and no one would be able to prove fraudulent activity of an electronic nature. DealGuardian is that electronic camera for the players.

    And for the profiting from rigging hands. Yes, it's more than just rake. They have your cash in their accounts. It's in their best interest to keep it there. Every time a player busts/reloads, there accounts get fatter. Do you think the cash is just sitting in a room somewhere collecting dust? Nope, it's most likely being invested in some way. Actually, several rooms became insolvent last year because player's money was being used for risky investments that went bad. Those players never saw their money again.

    So when players ask for there money back, they have to pull it from (most likely) an interest bearing account. If that account is generating revenue for the site, that hurts the bottom line. Did you ever wonder why the min deposit is $50, but the min withdrawal is $100 on some sites?

    I like a system like the one PokerPro uses at casinos. You put your money in, when you are done you cash out. If online would allow me to pull my cash out after every session that would be great. Then I know it's not being used elsewhere.

    Posted 9 months ago #

15. Eric Blade
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    There's nothing stopping you from doing that online, although with the delays that it takes (at least for US players) you'd probably hate doing it real quick. And, btw, everywhere I've seen PokerPro encouraged you to keep money in your PokerPro account, so that you wouldn't have to wait in line at the cashier to get money loaded. (And PokerPro is generally very hated by players, as well..)

    Every time a player busts/reloads, their accounts get fatter? Really? You mean, that money doesn't go to the other player, who may (or may not) withdraw it?

    How, exactly, does DealGurdian/SecureCardDealer improve upon the current situation? You haven't yet given one point that is even remotely possible, and yet you are going around to various places on the internet, accusing poker sites in a sideways-fashion of being cheats which must be the reason why they don't want your product.

    btw..

    Me: It would be impossible to setup a system whereby no one on the inside could tell what is going where.
    You: It is not impossible. We have built it.
    You: Bottom line is that you can't put a camera on electronic data. Anything is possible and no one would be able to prove fraudulent activity of an electronic nature. DealGuardian is that electronic camera for the players.

    That's a pretty huge disconnect there. (and I suppose the fact that players managed to prove the AP and UB issues, which have now been thoroughly investigated by their licensing body is somehow untrue?)

    Posted 9 months ago #

16. Nick Maiorana
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    We can dispute this back and forth. I have given you all the information how DealGuardian can protect players from internal fraud at poker sites. I have stated that we are in the online gaming security business, so it's in our best interest to provide the security we are touting.

    The best thing to do is let players decide. That's why we put together a online survey to see how players feel about online poker security. The survey is located here: http://www.securecarddealer.com/survey.aspx

    At this point I can only suggest getting as many players to take the poll as possible and let the community decide if anything needs to be done.

    Posted 9 months ago #

17. Nick Maiorana
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    Information about an independent survey: http://www.securecarddealer.com/rss/march-2009.html

    Posted 9 months ago #

18. Big Jim Slade v2.0
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    My apologies for my absence. I've been at the Borgata Open.

    Mr. nMaiorana says

    We are not going to submit our code for public view, part of our security depends on it so you are not going see it here.

    Apparently Nick is relying on Security through Obscurity, which implies a brittle architecture. In contrast, I was once told

    The easiest form of fraud is electronic. Especially when there is no way to prove (unless you get down to the source code) that something was setup to be unfair.

    How are we to validate your security, Nick, if we can't see what is happening? Or are you willing to say the person who told me this about the easiest form of fraud just doesn't know what he is talking about?

    [later edit - BTW, both quotes are from Nick]

    Posted 9 months ago #

19. Nick Maiorana
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    Hi Big Jim:

    Our architecture is solid and I think we have disclosed enough information of how our technology works. If it's not clear on our website, please let me know and I'll correct it. I still, and will always stand behind our statement that fraud at UB and Absolute could not have occurred with the DealGuardian service.

    For your second question our service removes information from the poker room until it's needed. This is partially for security reasons and also to provide a legitimate deal to the players. SCD does not profit from the outcome of any hand, so we have no vested interest in who wins.

    Online gaming is like the wild west. It will probably take another scandal for people like you to realize the importance of not allowing a single entity to control the cash, play and randomness required for a game. The world is not flat, we have put a man on the moon and you have no idea that rooms are dealing completely secure and random hands. They don't have to show you there code, and yet you freely accept that they have your best interest at heart. It won't be long till the next wakeup call so you can criticize all you like.

    We built something for players to give them a fair and unbiased game. This site is for online poker players and it should be looking out for there best interest in every aspect of the game, not just legalization.

    By the way, have you taken our survey yet?

    Posted 9 months ago #

20. Big Jim Slade v2.0
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    Nick, it appears you totally ignored my question. Both of my questions. Maybe you have me confused with an earlier poster, or maybe you just can't respond any better than you can spell. I'm not sure.

    So I'll abandon using your own quotes to show your inconsistencies and ask for some information. Consider the node diagram below:

    

    Where is the DealGuardian server located? Is it located with the poker room servers, or is it at your site?

    Posted 9 months ago #

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